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Post by betty on Jul 16, 2015 7:08:01 GMT -8
It's always difficult - but if you think one of your gerbils is being hounded by another one relentlessly - even if there are no visible injuries - the stress levels could be quite high - regardless of whether she is ACTUALLY being chased or whether she is just over-reacting. Is it is actually HER fear of something that is causing the over-reaction - and that is what counts in my eyes. It's a bit like people being totally phobic of birds or worms - it makes no sense to us (the un-phobic) but imagine if that bird was a live shark or whatever it is that you are scared of - then tell them they are over-reacting!
Other stresses could be similar I suppose to a human bully, They don't have to make contact with you at all, but they can certainly make your life a living hell from just being there in the background.
I have had gerbils - in what I class as a declan - physically panting in the tank even though there is not a cut on them - just lots of intermittent chasing. Usually sitting by the water bottle could just be a 'reason' to not be near the other one as well. Who wants to sit next to a bully when at any point they can be mean?
It's all very difficult and a personal choice to the owner themselves, but I have always separated mine after several days of noticeable chasing, as I take that as a warning sign - and I have had too many ACTUAL blood-drawn declans to want to see any again.
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Post by theia on Jul 16, 2015 8:24:34 GMT -8
I'm going to see if it lasts and if medication helps, it could be a result of her feeling poorly and not wanting to be pestered or maybe one of the two is on heat? As chasing seems to occur with my other two but only when one of them is on heat. I'll also have to decide what to do if it does call for splitting them up, especially as I don't even know if Nia will get better or not, so I wouldn't be sure who to take out and I have no spare tanks (or space really, we only wanted one cage to begin with and ended up with two lol).
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Post by betty on Jul 16, 2015 10:25:10 GMT -8
Well, heat usually only last for one evening in most females (and they clearly pinch their backs in and act weird) so if it is going on most days, then it can't be that really.
Also I always take out the one who is getting bullied as I think that they are most likely to split to new friend, and the one who has just 'overthrown' them deserves to stay put really after all their efforts? But that is just me. I don't have this anymore as I never put more than 2 females together after all the trouble I have had with trios over the years.
You really should get at least a small spare tank anyway (regardless of this issue) as if she gets more ill, they chase her more, they physically attack her or something else goes wrong - it is just good to know you have a tank spare already to put them in safely. Nothing worse than scrabbling around for something when there is already a mad rush.
Do be careful not to just hope they get on so you can keep them all in one tank - there might come a point when you say enough is enough. You just can't wish for gerbils to stay friends (if only you could - my life and that of all my beaten up gerbils would have been so much easier....).
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Post by theia on Jul 16, 2015 10:42:55 GMT -8
I do have tubs that I can make into makeshift tanks for emergencies, plus a spare water bottle and food bowl. It just isn't really ideal. I was hoping that we would be fine with these three as I'm pretty sure they are litter mates, but maybe the runt is proving too much of an easy target?
These girls seem so much more troublesome than the three males we had years ago. Never a problem with them in 3 or so years and health wise they were all fine until a couple of weeks before they passed.
I'll keep your advice in mind though, and if this continues for another day or two without any signs of improvement I shall set up a temporary tub tank for Nia (of course if I see any worsening or injuries I will pull her out as soon as).
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Post by theia on Jul 16, 2015 13:44:34 GMT -8
Definate declan just as I was setting up the big tub just in case.
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Post by t1gg3er on Jul 17, 2015 3:21:29 GMT -8
Oh dear. I hope Nia settles on her own & gets better.
I have a similar situation where I've removed an 11 week old boy from his dad & brother due to him being clearly stressed/scared & avoiding the other 2 as much as possible. If Nia follows the same pattern as him she should regain a little confidence day by day as she realises she's 'safe'. And maybe her sores will heal & she'll regain some weight now she's not in a stressful situation? I hope so.
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Post by theia on Jul 17, 2015 5:20:39 GMT -8
We actually decided to take Mia out instead, partly becuase she was easiest to grab when a fight started to break out. Nia seems much happier now that she's realised that Mia isn't there and Isis has been grooming her and they're currently sleeping together. We decided that if Nia gets better (we're hopeful that as you say some of the weight loss and sores were due to stress from Mia and therefore she should now be able to recover better + I just got back from the vets with more antibiotics and painkillers too) and as we can't feasibly have 3 permanent set ups we'll give it a couple weeks to see how Nia goes and then we'll look into rehoming Mia. Mean as it is to say Mia is our 'least favourite' gerbil (she's also the one that was incredibly aggressive when attempting a split with our 'favourite' (the one that wags her tail and is most confident around us) and husband really wasnt happy with her already after that, so this is the final straw for him I'm afraid) so rehoming her would be easiest on us out of the two (though personally having to rehome any breaks my heart a little, it's not just my decision though but my husbands too and technically we only got permission to have 1 cage of gerbils in our rented house so we're already stretching that as it is lol).
Nia was never avoiding Isis thankfully, she only squeaked when Mia was near and I think Isis just stayed around Mia because Mia was the big boss (big being very appropriate for her), it definately seemed like Isis put herself between Mia and Nia a couple of times to stop them from fighting, which is so sweet if that's truly the case. Nia is so much more relaxed already and Mia seems to be doing okay on her own too.
I hope your little boy is happier now too, and maybe one day he'll get a new friend?
If anybody has any tips on how to find a new home for a gerbil in the UK that would also be much appreciated, I'll probably make a new thread nearer the time to ask for advice too as I've never had to rehome a pet before.
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Post by theia on Jul 21, 2015 1:38:49 GMT -8
Well, Nia is definately a lot happier now than she was, getting more and more active each day. However I'm starting to get concerned by her previously crusty eye, it's looking a bit gunky in the front corner (I just got some warm water and tissue and had a go at cleaning it for her - she was not impressed lol). She's already on oral antibiotics so I'm guessing there's not much else a vet could do for her/offer her, it is just the one eye and the front corner that seems to be the problem, her other eye is perfectly fine. Is salt water a good idea or would that pose risks? I had been worried that it was cut/bleeding but I just recalled that their mucus is red so I'm pretty certain it's just a red coloured gunk. She'll be on the antibiotics for 2 weeks this time so hopefully that will be long enough to clear any lingering issues she might have with her nose and now maybe her eye too?
As a side note Mia also seems to be doing well on her own, she comes out to say hello and sniffs my hand for treats still. It's interesting to note that Mia is much more human friendly than some of the others (Isis will gently nip if you try stroking her but Mia will not nip she will just put up with it even though she generally dislikes being held), but it seems she does not do so well with other gerbils.
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Post by betty on Jul 21, 2015 12:38:51 GMT -8
I have found a few like that - so lovely and human friendly - but other gerbils are just a no-no. Funny little things.
Glad to hear all is well in the theia household now.
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Post by theia on Aug 5, 2015 6:55:10 GMT -8
I thought I'd give another update on Nia for anyone who is interested.
She finished her meds last week and I spent a week cleaning her crusty, gunky eye regularly with salt water, we then went away for 2 days which gave her plenty of time to relax and not be stressed by us having to mess around with her.
When we got back she looked like a completely different gerbil, she had got as low as 53grams at one point and was 55 when we left, but over those 2 days she gained another 2 grams (she weighed in at 58 today!!) and she started to regrow some patches of fur on her rear (that she lost from Mia biting her), her eye didn't get gunky or crusty at all while we were gone so that issue also seems to have cleared up. She just looks so much healthier right now, we haven't seen her look this happy in weeks. her nose is still iritating her but I started trying to illiminate potential allergens last friday (different bedding and different cleaner when washing their tank out) so hopefully if it's one of those things then it will be irritated less and less until it stops... *fingers crossed*. The only thing I really have left to try switching out is their food as I know Gerri gerbil changed their ingredients and I can't remember if it was before or after her nose started annoying her. Either way even if her nose forever annoys her she still seems happy and hopefully the weight loss she originally had was to do with bullying rather than her nose.
She comes out several times a day at the moment to beg for sunflower seeds, which I happily give her loads of to help her weight gain, it may not be too long before she gets back to her old weight again!
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Post by betty on Aug 5, 2015 7:58:19 GMT -8
That's great news - lets hope you get her nose cleared up and she should be back on track...
Good work.
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Post by theia on Sept 7, 2015 3:55:36 GMT -8
Final Update (I hope): It took way too long but the last round of anitibiotics we did a couple of weeks ago now seems to have finally done the job (we gave her bigger doses this time as her symptoms were suggesting a viral infection rather than an allergy - mucusy nose and eyes). She rubbed her nose almost completely bald there were rings of bald skin around her eyes which on one side was just a few hairs short of meeting up with her bald nose D: She also sounded like she had started to get an RI - wheezy breathing and very clear clicking noises, though I wonder if this could have been due to being stuffed up with mucus instead? Anyway, she has finally stopped rubbing at her face all the time, she is so very active again and I weighed her a few days ago and she was 61grams!! So close to being back to her normal weight Her nose has the tiniest patch of fur left to regrow, but otherwise she's back to normal and hopefully it will stay this way!
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Post by betty on Sept 7, 2015 4:28:08 GMT -8
Great news - lets hope she fills out those extra few grams to get back up to a healthy weight giving her a nice buffer if she feels down again at any point...
Good work.
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Post by t1gg3er on Sept 7, 2015 8:51:14 GMT -8
Really pleased to hear she's doing so well now. She looks lovely
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