|
Post by betty on Aug 8, 2020 14:12:52 GMT -8
I don't think her teeth are growing any faster than normal (unless you used to only get them trimmed every 6-8 weeks before and now they 'need' to be trimmed every 3 weeks?) - you just don't always notice it until something goes wrong - this is why they always have to chew stuff in their cages - otherwise they won't wear down.
And I seriously think you either need to discuss options with your existing vet - or see if you can find another one - £60 a time is WAY over the odds for any gerbil treatment for sure? Having the vet nurses do it should be even cheaper if they allow that. I am not sure really how your current vets can justify that cost?
As for your final question: If you are confident, experienced; have the right equipment and your gerbil sits totally still throughout then of course anyone can trim a gerbils teeth - as that is basically the service that vets and vet nurses are offering. Perhaps speak to your vet (or your new vet) and see if they will show you how to do it properly over the next few visits and see if you are happy to do it yourself.
Sometimes, depending on the original issue - the teeth can return to their normal selves and the trimming is no longer needed - but until they match up again - it is usually a trim every 6-8 weeks for sure.
|
|
Thea
Member
Posts: 1,012
|
Post by Thea on Aug 9, 2020 0:40:12 GMT -8
Wow, thank you for the long answer!
I know it's expensive, but really it's the only small-animal-friendly vet around, as far as I know. There could be ones further on, I'll have a good look tonight. The reason the vet has been so expensive is that they've been doing it with anesthetic, obviously just a little, but I've read that if they need anesthetic it is 'because you have neglected them or they have seriously overgrown', which I know I definately haven't done. I check both Rolo and Storme's teeth every 2 days if not every day, and give them plenty of hard wood to chew on.
For the teeth trimming at home: I think I might have to give it a go. My gerbils let me check their teeth without wriggling at all, I feel pretty confident, and if I could it would take a huge weight off my shoulders. Could you possibly advise me on what to buy to trim her teeth? If not, that's ok. I'll do some deep research into it and buy something as soon as I can! But definately better than taking her into the vet...
I also might have to as she has lost a tooth and the one remaining on the top will become way too long before the other one grows in. Thank you so much for your help, it's made me feel so much better! I can't have a proper talk with the vet so it's really made my situation easier.
|
|
|
Post by betty on Aug 9, 2020 3:07:51 GMT -8
That can't be true on many levels.
Even when mine have to have anaesthethic (which isn't ever a full anaesthethic it is just gas) for their teeth clippings it only added on a tenner (£25 tops) - I have NEVER paid anywhere near £60 for anything for a gerbil other than major operations (SGT and Ovarian cysts etc).
Secondly, the anaesthetic is only to keep the animal safe - it has NOTHING to do with how long the teeth are? Only if there has been secondary damage to the mouth that needs treating too (and at the same time) would this be applicable. I have found massive long teeth in gerbils and many are clipped while awake with the same process - one clip of the tooth. However, I would assume that an unconfident vet (or one that wants NO chance of being bitten) might opt for this technique as standard, thus allowing them more time to do the clipping and check the mouth fully.
As for what to use - obviously I would never 'recommend' anyone do it themselves as I don't know anyone's skill level, experience, confidence or equipment - and if you did accidently damage the mouth - then a vet would be needed anyway (great tip there then: don't clip your own gerbils teeth at night or on the weekend!).
However, saying that, just for reference, various vets I have used have had a battery of choices from cat nail clippers to human nail clippers to strong scissors to dental burrs (the best but usually veterinary only).
The key thing is that you need to CUT the tooth off - and swiftly; not snap it or keep pushing at it.
I personally prefer vets to use the curved cat clippers (as the whole tooth gets cut at the same time) and their curve helps you to gauge the cut before you cut it. I feel relieved when they get these out the drawer as their weapon of choice. They are also incredibly sharp. However if you have ever used them for nail clipping, they can be bulky-feeling because the ends overlap and you need to practice with them to get the angles and stuff right - but they do allow you to use the rest of your fingers to support/steady the hand.
Large nail clippers are curved on the blade too and are usually very sharp when new - however old worn out nail clippers just won't do as they may only dent the tooth (like sometimes you can't quite get your toenail off at the edges!!!). They need to be held straight on though as well, so can be awkward for a single person to get in position and then exert the right pressure one handed. Vets using these nearly always need a vet nurse (or me) to assist.
Dental scissors - very sharp strong ones - work on the thinnest of teeth. The way scissors work means that they push from one side to the other when you apply pressure to the handles, so not only can you not always get a proper or even cut - you are also potentially pushing the tooth sideways in the gum the whole time too - not great if you are trying to keep your gerbils teeth healthy? And certainly not great if you use household scissors instead - they just don't have the right attibutes and will most certainly cause some damage.
On a final note, I really find it a shame when people can't have an honest and comfortable chat with their local vets due to costs or indifference of one surgeon. Not only does it make people feel like they can't trust ALL these highly-trained individuals - but it also means that small animals around the world are not always getting the correct (or sometimes any) care.
Grr...
|
|
Thea
Member
Posts: 1,012
|
Post by Thea on Aug 9, 2020 4:35:13 GMT -8
Oh no! It's really the only small pet vet around unfortunately. I just go to the Vets4Pets where I live, and I've seen other gerbil owners on here go there. They do a good job always, but it would be good if the price was less...! I think for my cats the price hasn't been a lot, but smaller animals could certainly be cheaper. So with cat nail clippers, do you mean something like these? www.amazon.co.uk/LAIKA-Cat-Nail-Clippers-Professional/dp/B088WN2Q36/ref=sr_1_11?dchild=1&keywords=curved+cat+nail+clippers&qid=1596975742&sr=8-11www.amazon.co.uk/AMONIDA-Universal-Trimmer-Scissor-Clipper/dp/B08FBZXYDR/ref=sr_1_13?dchild=1&keywords=curved+cat+nail+clippers&qid=1596976079&sr=8-13www.amazon.co.uk/Lifreer-Clippers-Clipper-Grooming-Stainless/dp/B086ZNYW85/ref=sr_1_18?dchild=1&keywords=curved+cat+nail+clippers&qid=1596976079&sr=8-18I just have no idea what to get! And I totally understand about the safety of it all, it's my fault if something goes wrong. But if I'm able to learn to cut her teeth at home that would be way better, she's still young and has a life ahead of her, I'm sure. I also want to say that before the pandemic, I was quite able to have a good chat with the vet. Generally they were very nice, and willing to answer any questions or give other advice. Just now I'm not able to go in the room (nobody is as far as I know) and I have to wait in the waiting area. They just kind of handed her carrier to me and said she was doing great and that she might need some recovery time. That was about it. But tomorrow I'll make sure to ask questions if I can. I just remembered that it also wasn't the surgeon that gave her to me, it was the lady at the desk. She was nice, but I wouldn't think she could say much about Storme, because she hadn't done the clipping.
|
|
|
Post by Markpd on Aug 9, 2020 16:04:15 GMT -8
Check teeth every 1-2 days!? Wow! How often should they be checked? I don't think I'd be able to hold my pups at all atm!
|
|
Thea
Member
Posts: 1,012
|
Post by Thea on Aug 9, 2020 23:41:15 GMT -8
Check teeth every 1-2 days!? Wow! How often should they be checked? I don't think I'd be able to hold my pups at all atm! Haha, I know it's pretty often. I just over-worry about my little gerbils! Your main focus is just getting to know your gerbs right now, (btw I saw a video you posted of one, it's super cute!!) so teeth checking isn't a priority. Get to know them first, I promise they'll trust you soon enough. Mine were terrified of me for the first couple of weeks, but a year later they literally climb up my back and sit on my shoulder when I'm sitting down and they're running around... I think teeth don't need to be checked as often as I check them, but right now Storme's teeth are very fast growing so I worry myself too much if I don't! When they are comfortable with you, you can check them every week or so. They should be fine, but if they don't chew much they can get into a situation like Storme has! Also I'm pretty sure you'll know this already but a good length for their teeth is when they meet in the middle and don't go further, I think? That's what Rolo's are like, but Storme's are longer unfortunately. And I check their teeth by holding them a little above my head, and they let me gently lift their cheek so I can see their teeth. When I had my boys I did it differently because they didn't like that way, but there's always an easy way to check them while they're comfortable
|
|
|
Post by tanzanyte on Aug 10, 2020 1:45:55 GMT -8
Can I hijack this thread and ask how you tell if the bottom teeth are too long when the top teeth are currently missing? Also when to go to the vets to get the teeth trimmed if they aren't coming through equally at the top?
I'm in the same boat with Bubbles having lost her 2 top teeth. I can't work out what she's done it on (which is driving me mad!). Anyways we took her in straight away but it wasn't our normal vet and so she couldn't tell if both teeth were both still there (she's not used to small animals at all). We could see one tooth was still there but weren't sure about the other, so it's wait and see time. Bubbles is on metacam as she seems in a lot of discomfort. However she's not really taking it, even if mixed with baby food so at the minute we're having to get the stringe as close to her mouth and hope she gets it, she's a wriggler and it can go everywhere but her mouth. I've broken up her food with a rolling pin so it's much tinier pieces and thankfully she isn't losing weight so she must be eating something. However I'm worried about her bottom teeth in the meantime.
cmcsrthea27 - I hope your appointment goes ok today. Fingers crossed that you get the advice you need. I know exactly what you mean about trying to chat to the vets in the current climate, it's so much harder. I'd definitely be interested to find out what they say. Although I don't think I'm brave enough to try it on Bubbles when she doesn't know the meaning of still.
|
|
|
Post by Markpd on Aug 10, 2020 2:14:53 GMT -8
Check teeth every 1-2 days!? Wow! How often should they be checked? I don't think I'd be able to hold my pups at all atm! Haha, I know it's pretty often. I just over-worry about my little gerbils! Your main focus is just getting to know your gerbs right now, (btw I saw a video you posted of one, it's super cute!!) so teeth checking isn't a priority. Get to know them first, I promise they'll trust you soon enough. Mine were terrified of me for the first couple of weeks, but a year later they literally climb up my back and sit on my shoulder when I'm sitting down and they're running around... I think teeth don't need to be checked as often as I check them, but right now Storme's teeth are very fast growing so I worry myself too much if I don't! When they are comfortable with you, you can check them every week or so. They should be fine, but if they don't chew much they can get into a situation like Storme has! Also I'm pretty sure you'll know this already but a good length for their teeth is when they meet in the middle and don't go further, I think? That's what Rolo's are like, but Storme's are longer unfortunately. And I check their teeth by holding them a little above my head, and they let me gently lift their cheek so I can see their teeth. When I had my boys I did it differently because they didn't like that way, but there's always an easy way to check them while they're comfortable ******************************* Ah, phew, you had me worried . Yea my pups are very cute 🥰, thanks . That's awesome they run up and down you! I do remember from my last Gerbil, 32yrs ago, that he would run up my arm and sit on my shoulder, and when I sat down on the sofa he would jump off me to the sofa, then the window sill and roam around . I hope Storme's teeth get themselves sorted out soon! [edit]Grrr, stupid forum won't let me type out of the quote box!
|
|
Thea
Member
Posts: 1,012
|
Post by Thea on Aug 10, 2020 4:26:48 GMT -8
Can I hijack this thread and ask how you tell if the bottom teeth are too long when the top teeth are currently missing? Also when to go to the vets to get the teeth trimmed if they aren't coming through equally at the top? I'm in the same boat with Bubbles having lost her 2 top teeth. I can't work out what she's done it on (which is driving me mad!). Anyways we took her in straight away but it wasn't our normal vet and so she couldn't tell if both teeth were both still there (she's not used to small animals at all). We could see one tooth was still there but weren't sure about the other, so it's wait and see time. Bubbles is on metacam as she seems in a lot of discomfort. However she's not really taking it, even if mixed with baby food so at the minute we're having to get the stringe as close to her mouth and hope she gets it, she's a wriggler and it can go everywhere but her mouth. I've broken up her food with a rolling pin so it's much tinier pieces and thankfully she isn't losing weight so she must be eating something. However I'm worried about her bottom teeth in the meantime. cmcsrthea27 - I hope your appointment goes ok today. Fingers crossed that you get the advice you need. I know exactly what you mean about trying to chat to the vets in the current climate, it's so much harder. I'd definitely be interested to find out what they say. Although I don't think I'm brave enough to try it on Bubbles when she doesn't know the meaning of still. Hi tanzanyte- we're both in a similar problem then! Teeth problems aren't fun at all... Are you able to check inside her mouth easily enough? I think that if you were able to see when her top teeth were there before, you should be able to see if her bottom teeth are there too. It sounds like possibly they aren't there, but they could be. I find it just as easy to see the bottom teeth as the top ones, so maybe all her front teeth feel out? Poor Bubbles! With the food, I'm sure she's eating at least a bit because you should have seen her losing weight if not. Maybe weigh her if possible, and make sure to change her food regularly. If she doesn't mind, you can put just a little in her dish so you can see more easily if she's eaten or not. If she trusts you enough, she might take some off your finger. Storme did that and I knew she was okay. And with the teeth trimming, she might be ok. I would suggest making sure your vet is experienced or has done it before, otherwise it's just about as safe to do it yourself. Unfortunately if her teeth aren't equal, you probably will need to get them trimmed as one will be longer than the other. That's why I'm going to learn how to do it myself, as my Storme seems to have ongoing problems, and it's just not good for her to constantly go back in (and it's very expensive!!) Thank you too! I'm hoping it'll be ok too.. she's going in about 2 hours. Also hoping this is the last time! I'm glad someone understands about the talking, it's pretty hard. Not sure what to say to the vet really when I have limited time, I might not say about the teeth trimming at home when they are doing anaesthetic every time and possibly haven't done it much before...? But I'm sure we'll talk about it a bit because they can't send me off knowing I'll be back in under a month. That's just not how these things work. markpd- thank you, hoping there's an answer too! Also cute how yours did the same gerbils are so sweet!
|
|
|
Post by Markpd on Aug 10, 2020 5:21:52 GMT -8
Yea that's why I (eventually!) came back to them
|
|
|
Post by betty on Aug 10, 2020 5:32:39 GMT -8
Crikey - that's livened up this thread.
Yes, to the first clippers on your threads - I think the others might be too big and bulky looking - especially that second link - they would need grasping with your whole hand, not working well with an angled hand?
And as for teeth - the bottom teeth are always much longer-looking that the top ones - and go way back into the jaw. But yes, their length isn't so important as long as all 4 meet up neatly when touching together. I have a gruesome picturs of the bottom teeths full length somewhere...
As for offering food by hand to check their teeth - it HAS to be food with a shell. I know that might not seem to matter initially - but my toothless wonders earlier this year would still eat solid food - with their unaffected back teeth.
They would hoover up sunflower hearts and flaked oats all the time, just could not crack the husk off anything or eat the solid pellets in the food very easily. And of course - sadly - offering only soft or liquid foods doesn't help them wear down what front teeth they have left, so you sort of get trapped in a viscious circle of clipping and checking.
Hmm.
|
|
Thea
Member
Posts: 1,012
|
Post by Thea on Aug 10, 2020 7:32:11 GMT -8
I thought they might be too big as well. But thanks, I might order the first then?
Storme's in the vet right now, I'm (nervously) waiting to pick her up. The lady seemed unsure on whether or not you could clip teeth without anaesthetic, but judging from the answers on this thread you can... and other vets seemed to have done before. They're going to look on solutions, because obviously she can't go back in every 3 weeks.
And they said her bottom teeth were way too long so they had to sort them out now. They were hoping to be able to hold off for a couple of days but apparently that wasn't possible.
|
|
|
Post by betty on Aug 10, 2020 8:20:11 GMT -8
Nothing worst than just waiting outside is there!!!
I am sure they have thought of it - but why don't they contact other vets who have done this before? If they aren't sure on the procedure - perhaps they are over-estimating the length of her teeth - and thinking they need to cut more than they need to off? Maybe another vet could help them out here because if they are growing longer and faster than any other gerbil teeth - another vets might actually be very interested in knowing that.
|
|
Thea
Member
Posts: 1,012
|
Post by Thea on Aug 10, 2020 10:44:11 GMT -8
Exactly!
She's back home now, and they're a good length. That's a good point actually- I think they've done a fair amount of teeth trimming before but to see how others did it would probably help. The lady who sorted out her teeth actually helped my cat Bella last year with kidney disease (who unfortunately didn't make it because it wasn't curable), and she was really nice. She didn't decide the price and tried to cut it down a bit, so I don't think it was up to her...! But luckily I was able to have a bit of a chat with her.
|
|
|
Post by tanzanyte on Aug 12, 2020 4:34:47 GMT -8
We've checked Bubbles' mouth on a daily basis and both top teeth are coming through nicely - huge relief! She's not losing any further weight, we've checked on a weekly basis for a long time, but have increased it to daily now (although she could still do with losing some more because she's overweight anyway). Her bottom teeth were always there, I was worried they would get too long whilst she's not able to chew things and wear them down. We're going away tomorrow and my stepdaughter is in charge so they will be in good hands - she hasn't earned the name crazy rat lady for nothing. I've never moved the gerbies before as my stepdaughter has always come to ours twice a day to look after them and do playtime, however with both gerbils being ill we feel they need more round the clock care so if they move home for a week they can be checked on with more frequency. I'm a little worried about the stress for them but hopefully they will be ok as we are moving everything of theirs and they will still have a permanent play area to access. I'm leaving them with some clothing for their play area so that they hopefully don't forget me.
Betty - am I right in assuming that I should start giving her normal food and seeds with shells etc to test? I've been giving her oats and sunflower hearts by hand but I don't know whether I should be breaking up her food or trying her with it as it comes now that she has teeny teeth through.
Cmcsrthea27 - That sounds really odd that the vet wasn't aware their teeth could be clipped without anaesthetic. It sounds as though you are paying for inexperience on the vets part, and Storme is being put through something very dangerous when it needn't be done like that. Especially if it ends up being every few weeks. It's good that they seem to have recognised that something else needs to be done instead. Fingers crossed you are either able to do it yourself or that the nurse can do it for you without it costing a fortune. I'll see what I get charged as and when Bubbles needs to have her teeth trimmed.
|
|