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Post by LilyandDaisy on Aug 5, 2020 18:51:22 GMT -8
In that particular excerpt you've posted, I think it's specifically discussing neutering a pair or group of males in the hope of reducing aggression. It says that after the surgery, they may no longer recognise each other and neutering would not reduce territorial aggression. I would still agree that neutered male and female pairs are probably not an ideal arrangement though. I would never have got a male neutered for that reason but as this pair were already together at the rescue I thought it would be worth a try owning a neutered male but I'll don't think I'll do it again. Too much worry and stress.
Rocket and Storm have settled down a bit but they still have squabbles. A few weeks ago they were arguing every time they crossed each others paths, and it got to the point I had to remove the toys and all but one house and lower the bedding for a week. Then they calmed down to an average of 1-2 arguments per day. Now they have a normal tank setup again and still seem relatively calm most of the time. The past week Storm has even shown a little interest in Rocket (previously he kept out her way, and seemed a bit afraid of her) and she hasn't chased him away so hopefully things will improve.
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Post by Markpd on Aug 6, 2020 2:04:59 GMT -8
Oh yea, that sounded like it was touch and go! Good to hear it seems to be improving . As for my pair, Avon seems to be getting tamer already , but Blake's been getting more skittish! I can't even give him treats today! I must remember it's early days!
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Post by betty on Aug 6, 2020 2:34:55 GMT -8
Yes, in the 'castration' section - they sort of contradict themself (unless it's the translation?).
They say that the neutered male loses his station and is rejected due to having no hormones - ie the clan fails; then says later on that if there is a declan is ISN'T the hormones, it's the space?
Did I read it wrong?
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Post by Markpd on Aug 6, 2020 3:38:11 GMT -8
Hmm, it's a bit unclear, but the way I read it is where a declan has already happened due to the situation (e.g items or space), neutering doesn't help or can make matters worse as the group then can't identify it properly. Am I right in thinking that a declan is primarily between 2 Gerbils? If so, then perhaps trying to fix it by neutering a male could cause conflicts between it and the rest of the group? (If what he says is true, btw that guys runs a rescue ctr, it seems to have been running for 2 yrs).
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Post by betty on Aug 6, 2020 9:08:46 GMT -8
Ah, ok - if they did mean after a declan had already happened then if would be true - but it is also true for unneutered reintroductions: so unless the author can usually reintroduce a gerbil after a declan we are back to square one?
Would be interesting to find out if he CAN reintroduce after a 'blood-drawn' declan as that info would be gold dust on here!!!! Or whether he just meant if there is a challenge being made - neutering the challenger doesn't stop the eventual declan?
Declans are primarily only caused by the one gerbil - a non-boss who wants to be the boss. So indirectly the fight becomes between two gerbils as the existing boss needs to keep his place so he has to fight back to do that.
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Post by LilyandDaisy on Aug 6, 2020 9:20:10 GMT -8
I think they meant when a pair is headed towards a declan, neutering won't make a difference, and the difference in scents after a neuter might actually cause them to not accept each other post surgery (so actually hastening the declan).
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Post by betty on Aug 6, 2020 9:35:47 GMT -8
Yes, that was the most likely reasoning - although there is always hope that one day we will find a way to reintroduce or extend the time that clans stay together?
I suppose you can never find out anything new if you don't try anything?
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Post by Markpd on Aug 6, 2020 12:11:30 GMT -8
I think they meant when a pair is headed towards a declan, neutering won't make a difference, and the difference in scents after a neuter might actually cause them to not accept each other post surgery (so actually hastening the declan). Yea that's what I was thinking.
Betty True!
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