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Post by elliriyanna on Mar 7, 2015 19:34:54 GMT -8
My friend has a lone female gerbil she is less than a year old and was given to her when a local store stopped carrying gerbils. The problem is ... she is alone and stores in our area have been confirmed to have a deadly rat virus, which she has rats and it could kill them all to bring home a gerbil as its airborne and noone on CL etc has any.
So I have offered to lend her my boy Eddy to breed, I will take some of the sons and this way her female will not have to spend her life alone.
We are curious if we do go through with the breeding though ( we have done a lot of research and I know Eddy can't come home until the males are separated because he needs to help her) we are curious what colors we may get.
Eddy is a red fox, Her girl is a Lilac.
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Post by betty on Mar 8, 2015 0:42:28 GMT -8
Genetically, if they both have red eyes you will only get red eyed babies. And they are both on the Black side of colours (self) so this limits your colours to Lilac only for sure.
If the Lilac carries the Fox gene (e) then some will be Red Foxes too. There could be some other colours too like Red Eyed Silver Nutmegs, Doves and Sapphires, but these are much less likely.
Do you know anymore about your boy's family as this could help with the genes? Is he alone because you have bred him before?
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Post by elliriyanna on Mar 8, 2015 3:50:45 GMT -8
He isn't alone he lives with his two sons who he came to me with. They are both red fox as well. My thinking was that I could bring him back with a couple babies and set up a different tank for them, leaving the two sons together.
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Post by betty on Mar 8, 2015 4:10:33 GMT -8
Ah ok. Who was he bred to before as this could help narrow down his genes - especially if ALL his pups were Red Fox.
I am not an expert on clan bonding, but you would best ask some breeders about taking out the dad from a trio. The reason I bring it up is that currently your Eddy (the dad) is the clan leader. His offspring are sub-ordinate to him as he is 'the boss' and always will be (until he gets too ill or too old). The two boys are kept in line by him being there.
However, I am not 100% sure what would happen if you took him out? I'm sure there would be a re-ordering of 'power' but I am not sure if this will be calm and friendly or whether it could cause a fight. Please get some experienced advice before you remove the dad - just incase...
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Post by elliriyanna on Mar 8, 2015 6:01:49 GMT -8
I have no idea on the color of the pups mom.
In the group I am actually not sure who is dominant eddy being dominant would make sense but I never see any of the typical behavior you would see from an " alpha"
Ans we are still on the fence about breeding, its a big responsibility even though both of us have experience with rodent litters
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Post by betty on Mar 8, 2015 7:45:59 GMT -8
Your Eddy WILL be the clan leader whether he shows signs or not. His age and authority would have blessed that onto him - whether or not you see him flouting it about is another matter. The sons would never need to challenge his for authority all the while he was healthy.
I never see my dads doing anything overly 'manly' in their trios - and what they do do, their sons do too. But them some of my females don't really faff about a lot with the whole show - but there must be a leader of course as that is how gerbil society works.
And yes, breeding does bring with it a lot of responsibility - and lot more gerbils needing homes... I never thought I would keep as many as I did.
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Post by elliriyanna on Mar 8, 2015 16:47:01 GMT -8
we are still talking about it, and we would of course be praying for a small litter. But I personally raised a litter of 15 hamsters after a cage mix up and placed them all successfully. ( minus the two I kept)
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Post by elliriyanna on Mar 9, 2015 17:31:11 GMT -8
I do remember when I adopted Eddy that the woman said that his daughters were the same color but sad like a silver dusting? Any idea what that could be?
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Post by betty on Mar 10, 2015 6:53:25 GMT -8
Well there are only 3 colour types that are ginger: Saffrons (Red Foxes), Argentes, and Red Eyed Honeys. Find a picture of each and show them to her - they are all quite distinctive.
Saffron/Red Fox - Ginger all over including tummy
Argente - Ginger all on back with white on the tummy only
Red-Eyed Honey - Ginger and white on the body, the back is ginger and the tummy, sides, neck and around the eyes is white.
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Post by elliriyanna on Mar 10, 2015 13:13:38 GMT -8
I no longer have her info, my email glitched, my guess would be Argente
Edd ed and eddy all are saffron though their tummies are a couple shades lighter
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Post by Shooting Star on Mar 10, 2015 18:15:12 GMT -8
Silver dusting suggests Argente.
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Post by elliriyanna on Mar 12, 2015 8:06:40 GMT -8
Does knowing the father is a Saffron who produces Saffron and Argente and the mother is a lilac help at all? Also once she is here I will have her color confirmed.
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Post by betty on Mar 12, 2015 9:12:19 GMT -8
A Saffron on its own can't produce Argente (and there are 3 shades of Argente), and the Saffrons have 2 genes that the Argente doesn't need to have. So it would have been the mum who 'made' the Argentes so to speak.
A Saffron would be aa C* ee pp U*
A (full) Argente A* CC E* pp U*
A Lilac is an Argente (on the self side - a pink-eyed Black) and so is the same genes bar the first letter
aa CC E* pp U*
Eddy would have had to have bred with a gerbil on the Agouti side to have Argente pups. I wouldn't go too much on the genes of someone who doesn't already know the genes.
So if you were to mate a Saffron to a Lilac you could only guarantee getting Lilacs because they are the only genes you know for sure. If the Lilac has e in the mix you will also get Saffrons. If the Saffron has a colourpoint gene you could get Sapphires or Doves (paler Lilacs). You won't know these unless you get family histories of the gerbils involved - which you don't currently have.
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Post by elliriyanna on Mar 13, 2015 7:10:39 GMT -8
Well I guess we will just have to wait and see.
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Post by elliriyanna on Mar 19, 2015 19:05:04 GMT -8
Ok change of plans, We decided to pair the son Ed with Michelle. We know only a touch more about Ed's genetics and thats that he was part of an Argente and Saffron litter. But no matter what they produce they all have homes with us and will be well loved and cared for. Here are the two of them together.  |
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