New here! Is this boy I rescued Burmese uw sp?

[cripplecrow]

I am new to gerbil genetics (just spent an hour reading up). I’m curious as to what genes my little boy (Dr Gregory Mouse) here might have. The dark tail and ears is making me think some Burmese but obviously washed out by maybe uw? Or Can the sp gene also caused a washed out effect? Or is this not Burmese at all and justed an underwhite spotted?! And his brother (F Scott Fitzgerbil) is a basic agouti right? Thanks in advance for your wisdom guys! Ps. This is just a temporary tank (that common ‘gerbilarium sold) which his previous owners kept him in with his brother. I’m moving them today to a 25gal.

[betty]

Hey - Gregory Mouse - great (I had a 13 and Foreman myself).

As for colours - yes looks like Agouti FitzGerbil (for sure); and from that picture I would say a spotted Burmese (ie a Burmese with the dominant spotting gene - although some people may name the pattern type as pied or variegated or something). And yes, the spotting gene is responsible for the faded colour.

The very dark tail is a give-away as Burmese as genetically they are colourpoint blacks - so they retain the black tail (or as near as). A Colourpoint Slate (uwduwd) wouldn't have such a dark tail. Gregory also seems too dark here for a Siamese.

[cripplecrow]

Amazing! I am in love with this boy already. Funny you also had House name!
Thanks for your help.

[tuftsnfluff]

Hey there!

Agreed on the colors..

But.. isn't the Burmese pattern still considered Mottled because of the flecking on the back? Whether it be light or heavy?

I had always thought any white anywhere other than the head, around neck (if Pied), feet, and tail tip was considered Mottled.

variegated is just another term for "light mottling" isn't it?

Just curious..

[cripplecrow]

Mar 21, 2019 8:15:00 GMT -8 tuftsnfluff said:

Hey there!

Agreed on the colors..

But.. isn't the Burmese pattern still considered Mottled because of the flecking on the back? Whether it be light or heavy?

I had always thought any white anywhere other than the head, around neck (if Pied), feet, and tail tip was considered Mottled.

variegated is just another term for "light mottling" isn't it?

Just curious..

So does that mean no uw? Sorry I’m very new to this despiste having a degree partly in genetics Hahahah. On a side not Is uw recessive yeah? So you think Burmese with sp allele which is producing pied? I’m also drunk right now sorry...

[tuftsnfluff]

Well..

Golden Agouti's basic genetic pattern is::   A*-C*-E*-Uw*-P*

Burmese basic pattern is::    aa-c(hm)/c(hm)-E*-Uw*-P* and Sp* (since yours is spotted)

You wouldn't know what the 2nd loci of the "Uw" is unless you breed the Burmese and get  "uw(d)"  pups in the litters.

But it depends on what the mother has as well AND it can take quite a few litters for it to show up

For me in my area  "uw(d)" is the HARDEST loci to get!

[cripplecrow]

Mar 21, 2019 8:26:54 GMT -8 tuftsnfluff said:

Well..

Golden Agouti's basic benetic pattern is -- A*-C*-E*-Uw*-P*

Burmese basic pattern is -- aa-c(hm)/c(hm)-E*-Uw*-P* and Sp+ (since yours is spotted)

You wouldn't know what the 2nd loci of the Uw is unless you breed the Burmese and get  "uw(d)"  pups in the litters.

But it depends on what the mother has as well.

For me in my area  "uw(d)" is the HARDEST loci to get!

So It’s definitely not underwhite ?you guys are amazing . Are you all hobby breeders? I have a lot of rat breeding experience but am moving into gerbils and just want to do it as responsibly as possible . My females are bb E* P* Sp and not sure about uw (again) ... any idea ?

[cripplecrow]

Mar 21, 2019 8:31:25 GMT -8 cripplecrow said:

Mar 21, 2019 8:26:54 GMT -8 tuftsnfluff said:

Well..

Golden Agouti's basic benetic pattern is -- A*-C*-E*-Uw*-P*

Burmese basic pattern is -- aa-c(hm)/c(hm)-E*-Uw*-P* and Sp+ (since yours is spotted)

You wouldn't know what the 2nd loci of the Uw is unless you breed the Burmese and get  "uw(d)"  pups in the litters.

But it depends on what the mother has as well.

For me in my area  "uw(d)" is the HARDEST loci to get!

So It’s definitely not underwhite ?you guys are amazing . Are you all hobby breeders? I have a lot of rat breeding experience but am moving into gerbils and just want to do it as responsibly as possible . My females are bb E* P* Sp and not sure about uw (again) ... any idea ?

Ok doesn’t look uw.... is uw resessive ? And Uw dominate showing no mottled /pied etc. Sorry for incessant questions. Just like to hear from experts . I posted in cage section about cage sizes and I’m freaking out. I just want them to be the happiest they can be. Feel so responsible as I’m sure you enthusiasts all understand

[tuftsnfluff]

Well Uw is the Dominant Gene of the Loci -- used to be called "G"  

The recessive of the loci is "uw(d)"  --  used to be called "g"

Uw doesn't have anything to do with spotting.   That's a separate Loci all together.

How I understand it is -- Uw is responsible for the amount of Gold coloring in the coat BUT.. a mutation in the Loci popped up that turned Gerbils "cream" colored.

Due to the same thing that occurs in mice, it was adopted over to help with gerbil genetics to make more sense and went from "G" to being "Uw".

So when looking at your Agouti --  It has Dom "Uw", and if you want to get technical a non-spotted (solid colour) is "nothing" in the spotting department.

So having no spotting isn't "spsp".

It's just a gerbil. So if you HAD to write something down when there was nothing, you'd write +.  But it isn't necessary and most drop the + all together when a gerbil isn't spotted.

Your Burmese is  Dom "Uw" and unknown in its 2nd Loci.     And because it is spotted, it would be written with "Sp" at the end of the genetic thread.

Sorry, I meant to put a asterisk (*) not a plus sign at the end of your Burmese basic genetics.

And, having the Spotting gene also affects the coat color by lightening it a bit as well.. so when you pair that with genes that also lighten coat color -  (uw(d), e(f), (d), etc) - it can get even MORE confusing.  LOL

It is unknown if either of your gerbils at this time have the recessive "uw(d)" gene and you won't know unless you take the time to breed them a few litters and know what the mother's genetic code is.

Not sure where the "bb" is coming from (unless a typo!), there isn't a "B" Loci with gerbils.

There IS a "Dilute" gene however,  --  " D "   which is a recent Loci discovery, I think within the last 40 years or so?   Can't remember.

Turns Black gerbils a Russian "Blue" color -- but no need to worry about THAT right now as its somewhat rare still and no need to confuse you any more than I may have already!

Does this help any??

Oh!  And if you would, please remember to resize your pictures on your hosting sight

400 x 600 pixels is a good size to see and not be too small.

It also helps on lots of scrolling!  THANK YOU!

[Gerbil_Nannie_Sg]

Mar 21, 2019 9:36:05 GMT -8 tuftsnfluff said:

Well Uw is the Dominant Gene of the Loci -- used to be called "G"  

The recessive of the loci is "uw(d)"  --  used to be called "g"

Uw doesn't have anything to do with spotting.   That's a separate Loci all together.

How I understand it is -- Uw is responsible for the amount of Gold coloring in the coat BUT.. a mutation in the Loci popped up that turned Gerbils "cream" colored.

Due to the same thing that occurs in mice, it was adopted over to help with gerbil genetics to make more sense and went from "G" to being "Uw".

So when looking at your Agouti --  It has Dom "Uw", and if you want to get technical a non-spotted (solid colour) is "nothing" in the spotting department.

So having no spotting isn't "spsp".

It's just a gerbil. So if you HAD to write something down when there was nothing, you'd write +.  But it isn't necessary and most drop the + all together when a gerbil isn't spotted.

Your Burmese is  Dom "Uw" and unknown in its 2nd Loci.     And because it is spotted, it would be written with "Sp" at the end of the genetic thread.

Sorry, I meant to put a asterisk (*) not a plus sign at the end of your Burmese basic genetics.

And, having the Spotting gene also affects the coat color by lightening it a bit as well.. so when you pair that with genes that also lighten coat color -  (uw(d), e(f), (d), etc) - it can get even MORE confusing.  LOL

It is unknown if either of your gerbils at this time have the recessive "uw(d)" gene and you won't know unless you take the time to breed them a few litters and know what the mother's genetic code is.

Not sure where the "bb" is coming from (unless a typo!), there isn't a "B" Loci with gerbils.

There IS a "Dilute" gene however,  --  " D "   which is a recent Loci discovery, I think within the last 40 years or so?   Can't remember.

Turns Black gerbils a Russian "Blue" color -- but no need to worry about THAT right now as its somewhat rare still and no need to confuse you any more than I may have already!

Does this help any??

Oh!  And if you would, please remember to resize your pictures on your hosting sight

400 x 600 pixels is a good size to see and not be too small.

It also helps on lots of scrolling!  THANK YOU!

heya this is Joey 2007 SG breeder who discovered the uw gene, I am back and would like to hear more about this wonderful gene mutation. Hit me on the DM thanks!

[Markpd]

This thread is nearly 4yrs old, which I don't mind an old thread being revived for a specific purpose like this, but if you look at tuftsnfluff profile you'll see that she hasn't been online since 3/2020 or posted since 8/2019, so you're very unlikely to get a reply from her unfortunately.

PS I moved your reply to her quote out of her quote to your reply window.