Energy useage and tech

[icecontroller2529]

Admin edit by Markpd

This is a conversation that started in this thread talking about the heatwave we recently had in the UK and Europe, I thought it deserved it's own thread and I didn't want my thread taken too OT , hence starting this one .

Btw, if anyone would like a different title for it LMK.

And icecontroller2529 , I bet you don't remember starting this thread? (you didn't, I did, but because your post was the oldest it became the 1st over my one!).

Aug 13, 2022 13:35:08 GMT -8 betty said:

This is the issue - but I like to be ahead of the crowd. I am sure that there will be plenty of new things going on with houses in the UK that we haven't needed before - but are now becoming serious considerations.

Since I started researching air con units and talking about them -I have found that at least 6 other people have already bought one themselves too. I love hearing that they are loving them and can't believe how amazing a cool house is! I suppose it is one of those things that you only realise the benefits of when you already have one - like a dishwasher. I can wash up myself - but everyone out there says they love it - it saves time, keeps the kitchen tidier and sooo much easier. So, I think it will come good soon enough. We already have it in cars - so why not our homes?

Same with the shutters - we never needed air con last year - we didn't really have enough heatwaves - but how things have changed this past 12 months - climate change has really bitten!

All change.

******************************************************************************************************************************************

For those among us humans who are uncomfortable with too much sunlight, I can recommend UV protection window film. We tried it out last year and it worked a charm. Had to remove it for a reason and I miss it intensely!

Advantages: 

• The film is supposed to be UV resistant, so hopefully you won't get a tan or cancer.
• Less blinding, pleasant for the eyes.
• The room stays cooler.
• Easy to order online, you tell them the measurements of your windows and they will send you the correct films.
• The film is easier to put on the windows than you would expect.
• Removing it is even easier - and leaves absolutely no damage on the windows.

Disadvantages:

• It's a bit pricy.
• The view outside will get slightly blurry.

Anybody else here who tried window film?

[Markpd]

Can't say I have, I would think a major component of sunlight includes infra red (heat), so I wouldn't have thought UV film would be as affective at keeping the rooms cool vs shutters or even curtains? Though of course you can see through UV film

Oh btw, I know that regular glass does remove quite a bit of UV by itself, I know being in a car with the windows closed I've never got burnt (I burn easily), but if I have with the window open with my arm on it, I've certainly got burnt on that arm before! lol

betty

Yea I caved and bought a dishwasher last year (only because doing the washing was for some reason really doing my head in back then!), so glad to have it still .

Re shutters in France, most of my French 1/2 of the family live near Angers (sort of mid west France), both my Aunts house and 1st cousin's house have outdoor shutters, and I do vaguely recall my Aunt's house at least (which her and my Uncle had since the late 70s) being pretty cool inside, even during hot summers!

Re AC units for the home, was discussing this with a mate the other night, he mentioned the one he looked at drew 1400w!! (I'm going to stick with getting a couple of stand fans for now! Stand fans are typically 30-40w).

That's quite a lot of power for AC, although for the UK, you wouldn't need to run it often.

Did you look at how much power they drew betty?

[betty]

We still don't have a dishwasher - and with these potential energy price rises - I am sort of glad!

As for the a/c - yes, ours is 1200w - but the math shows that just for the hour or so it takes to cool the room right down on really hot days it would be less that 50p (standing charge not included) - so even a good few hours is probably not much more than all the fridge and freezers openings and closing throughout the day keeping everyone refreshed (and the time it takes me each day).

Also, once the air is cooled down to the low 20s you don't need to blow it around with the normal fans - just keep the doors closed. So athough it is more expensive it is faster and better for effecting a drastic temperature change, which is what I require/want.

Anything under 25 - I think we will leave to normal fans anyway - it is only when it goes above that and/or for longer that I will be using the a/c. Sad times this climate change...

[tanzanyte]

It’s horrifying to think this could be the norm. And scary with little to no investment going back into water options and sewage etc when we’ve had yet another sewage leak in the sea due to the storms caused by an overflow.
We went away and they had several wildfires in Cornwall. Everything is tinder dry.
I think we may be looking into an Ac unit for the ridiculous heatwaves if this is what we’ll face year on year from now on, but we are worried about the energy consumption. We have a dishwasher but wait until it’s absolutely full and still wash up. They always reckon a dishwasher uses less water yet they tell you to rinse things and I’m pretty sure they don’t include that in the water consumption. It’s all a con!
Hopefully in the next few years we’ll get some more eco friendly solutions for cooling houses.

[betty]

Let's hope so - hopefully now it is actually HERE people will finally take it seriously?

I have been a member of Centre for Alternative Technology for years - but their magazine is so inaccessible that even I have trouble feeling enthused - and I am already the converted!


(they do some great stuff though - but you need to be really active yourself - they don't seem to reach out in the places that they could be the most helpful?)

[tanzanyte]

I'm not sure people will take it seriously though. The problem is that the whole carbon offset system businesses have gone with isn't helping. People are thinking and feeling as though they are doing something but it's not enough as is just papering over cracks, and is a quick, cheaper thing for businesses to do to make it look like they fulfilling their obligation when really it just allows them to carry on with things regardless.

I only found out about CAT when we were on holiday last year in Wales, only we didn't get to check it out as we ran out of time. I meant to go back to their website but forgot so thank you for reminding me. It's a shame if it's that inaccessible when you have an active interest in being environmentally friendly. They clearly need to have a rethink!

I've tried to drill so much into the kids and have changed lots of things I use (I also love that our main supermarket has got so many more things that are eco friendly now), but there's still so much further left to go, and they need to make things more accessible for families in financial difficulty.
The pet supplies bother me as some things are very wasteful and I've been looking for ways to move towards more greener options there too. I have the WWF carbon footprint app and hadn't realised how much pets add to your total.

[betty]

Yes, I do believe they need - maybe not a rethink of what they already have - but they need a new 'wing' so that they are active outside of their own property. They have all sorts of great stuff there and their new uni and everything - but what the world needs (to accept alternative technologies as the norm) is for them to come out here and chat with us rather than wait for us to find them. Their online shop is also very poor compared to what is out there.

Can you imagine the impact they could be having helping people understand kwh right now - and how to use energy more wisely in general. Wow - they could really be making a HUGE difference to people's lives as well as sneak in all their great work under the guise of free energy living tips.

Energy efficiency and energy saving tips don't need to be annoying and minor stuff like turn the lights off, put up door curtains and shower with a timer they can at least be equal: so, changing games consoles for example could be a massive daily saving (some are as low as 70w and others like PS5 and some PCs can be up to 400w), cooking with an air fryer (instead of electric ovens), soaking rice/pasta in water before cooking instead of boiling it from dry, simply closing the conservatory door (or sunniest room) to keep the heat in (when not in a heat wave!) so there is no heating needed early evening when arriving home.

All obvious ways to use energy differently and in a positive way each time rather than having to always think 'have I switched this off', 'have I used that too long'. Planning ahead can really help save energy - and money - rather than having everyone chasing around after each other, nagging each other.


Oh dear. It's not been about heat waves OR gerbils there - just get a bit frustrated seeing energy 'wasted' because there hasn't been anyone sharing these things beforehand. Only now people are really struggling - or in energy debt - are they finding out that there were some really easy fixes/alternatives the whole time - just that they weren't out there.

But yes - in terms of animals overall (inc cats, dogs, ferrets and rabbits) it is frightening how much they can cost in carbon sums. Foods, vets, chemicals - not to mention toys, soft furnishings and 'waste' all get added in. Smaller animals still add up as their grains and seeds travel so far around the world. Exotics and heating too. And water consumption is quite high too across the board. Hmm...

[Markpd]

Well water consumption by our gerbils is low .
I use unused water from the gerbils drinking water to water plants.

Re computer power use, now that's an area I'm familiar with (somewhat less so with game consoles), generally the more power hungry ones are also the faster ones, countering that to some degree is that more modern tech tends to use less power for the same work done. But of course newer tech is generally more expensive! If you want the high res games on big screens, or virtual reality, you need the powerful machines!

Also re PC power usage, if a PC was rated as using 400w, that would likely be a full load power rating (gaming would be close to full load). So unless the PC is only being used for gaming, it would use a lot less power for say surfing the net. My own desktop PC uses ~70w (idle, ie with no real load on the CPU or graphics card/GPU), when I'm running one of my Distributed Computing projects on the CPU (data crunching for various science projects) that goes up to about 113w (depending on the project), if I run one of the DC projects on the GPU that adds over 100w to the power draw! Roughly 230w in all, it's a low-mid spec graphics card, but it's also an old one (4yrs old, but a 5yr old design). I've been wanting a faster, less power hungry card for a couple of years, but the chip shortage put the prices up to silly levels! Thankfully prices are dropping now, so maybe finally I can!

[betty]

All quite frightening when you actually start to work it out isn't it. The simplest of things have been overlooked.

And I must admit I meant the water I use in washing and cleaning everything (especially wheels) all the time with my crew - they might not drink much - but they certainly use up a lot of water on a weekly basis - and it is inherent in their seed and grain production too (which I am sure carbon calculators take into account).

Good job they don't wear cotton too...

[tanzanyte]

I know it's OT but its still interesting. I had very little idea about games consoles or computers using so much and really didn't know there was such a big difference between manufacturers. Although we don't really game in this household, except my son plays on his iPad rather than an additional games console. Currently it isn't what I'd count as major gaming like a lot of his friends, although I never know whether it will be just around the corner given his age.

I for one haven't ever soaked pasta beforehand so I'm going to do that now. Out of interest how long do you soak it for and how fast does it then cook if it's usually 10-12 minutes from dry?

Do we know if anyone has ever worked out the actual energy consumption per pet type so that we have an idea of food and such like to make better choices about things?
I generally try and buy things make in the UK but have to admit for pet stuff I don't always check (and often don't have the choice). I also avoid dyed things if there are more natural alternatives but still feel I have a long way to go in this area.

[Markpd]

Created a new thread, so no longer OT .

An iPad doesn't use much energy, so nothing to worry about on that front at least!

[icecontroller2529]

Aug 14, 2022 10:47:52 GMT -8 icecontroller2529 said:

And icecontroller2529 , I bet you don't remember starting this thread? (you didn't, I did, but because your post was the oldest it became the 1st over my one!).

Being a person with troubled understanding of technical stuff, I found this quite confusing. 

[betty]

Sept 2, 2022 13:35:08 GMT -8 tanzanyte said:

I for one haven't ever soaked pasta beforehand so I'm going to do that now. Out of interest how long do you soak it for and how fast does it then cook if it's usually 10-12 minutes from dry?

Apparently it *is* cooked after soaking for at least an hour - if you don't mind eating cold pasta? However, most of us would want to add the sauce and heat it up in the microwave for a mintue of two when you are ready to eat it. Basically this is what pre-cooked pasta and rice are apparently.

Lots of people say they do it overnight - so they can make their lunch with it (cold) in the morning before work/college/whatever - but I suppose you would have to test it a few different way to see how it suits you.

[tanzanyte]

That is genius Betty! My daughter makes pasta up for school the next day so I'll be getting her to soak it from now on. I'm ashamed to say that this has never occurred to me before.

I'm pleased iPads aren't power hungry. At least that's one plus with the amount of time he can spend on it in the holidays.
I am getting better with not leaving lights on etc. Unfortunately we don't have a smart metre to be able to work out what costs the most to be able to make the most improvements. I know my friend said that she roasted a chicken one Sunday and it cost £4 to heat it up in her oven. Apparently lots of people are moving over to dry fryers or Remoska's that there's now a shortage of those. I do love my oven though, but need to look into it all more to see how much of a difference it actually makes.

I have been trying to get more eco friendly things for the gerbils and make sure I buy panda bamboo toilet paper, it's less dusty too so has been much better and has no plastic wrapping.
It would be really handy if people have products they know are eco friendly that they've found are really helpful with gerbils. Although that may be better in a different thread given that this is tech.

[Markpd]

You can buy plug in the wall power meters (I bought one some years ago to see my PC's power usage), but of course that only works if the device has a plug itself and isn't hardwired.

As for how much power devices use, AFAIK all electrical devices here in the UK and EU have their max power rating on them (I'd imagine so for US too?). But of course, for things which either switch on and off (e.g fridges) or things that aren't necessarily run at full power when they are on (fans, microwaves) that doesn't help you work out how much power they actually use.

For bulbs, old fashioned incandescent ones use quite a lot of power (relative to LEDs), fluorescent (compact or not) less so, LEDs the least. An LED bulb will use about 1/10th of the power of an old incandescent bulb (the halogen ones fair a little better, but really not worth getting these days). When my kitchen fluorescent strip light was replaced with an LED one, the LED one was rated at nearly 1/2 the power .

And very roughly, heating of any kind uses a lot of energy, it used to be the case here in the UK that it was cheaper to heat (including cooking) with gas, but I'm not so sure now.