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Post by ma on Sept 13, 2004 20:12:13 GMT -8
how long will a litter of one single pup will survive until he is crucial? and how often does he need to be feeded baby formula/boiling water mix?
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Post by ma on Sept 13, 2004 21:01:33 GMT -8
this is a matter of life and death. please help
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Post by j on Sept 13, 2004 21:12:22 GMT -8
Not sure..  I know with 1 pup it's hard because they can't stimulate the milk out of the mother on it's own. Check his stomach, if he's drinking milk you'll be able to see it a white spot in his stomach kind of. Is the mother at least trying to take care of it? The first couple of days is the most crucial. Never heard of using babyformula/boiling water. Most people use kitten replacement milk, (KMR milk) which you can get at any petshop..even grocery stores have it. Never had to feed pups before so I don't know how often they need to eat. Keep an eye on him and just let him eat as much as he wants. Or whenever he squeaks and is trying to get milk for the mother try feeding him. Can also try soaking a piece of bread in kitten milk and leaving it near him, he might suck the milk off that. |
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Post by j on Sept 13, 2004 21:16:07 GMT -8
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Post by ma on Sept 13, 2004 21:23:50 GMT -8
hey thank you so much. this really is so important. it could die without the proper care. and its so cute...
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Post by blackie on Sept 13, 2004 23:05:22 GMT -8
Are you the same person who posted "single litter pup" yesterday? I think you better just read the breeding websites carefully and you could try getting some advice from a vet if there are any vets who are experts on small animals in your area.
Remember the milk should not be too hot, it should be the same temperature as the inside of your wrist.
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Post by ma on Sept 14, 2004 5:26:24 GMT -8
Are you the same person who posted "single litter pup" yesterday? I think you better just read the breeding websites carefully and you could try getting some advice from a vet if there are any vets who are experts on small animals in your area. Remember the milk should not be too hot, it should be the same temperature as the inside of your wrist. no i am not the same person. last night was the first time i'd ever been here |
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Post by blackie on Sept 14, 2004 6:07:57 GMT -8
OK. It was just a coincident then. Well if the pup does not get milk at all from its mother it will most likely starve to death in 48 hours. If it just isn't feeding enough, I don't know. I can imagine what a complicated situation you must be in. Normally gerbils will manage to take care of their babies without any help from us at all. If there are weak pups, they will die, this is a "course of nature". It's your desicion to intervene and try to feed the little thing, but you don't have to. If the pup dies, the gerbil mother will accept it, and in a couple of days she will forget about it. Maybe she will be more lucky if she has another litter. If you on the other hand manage to feed the pup, great for you, but this means a lot of work and you have to be very careful. If I were you I would not really seek the information I needed from the internet, I would ask a vet. By the time you read this you have probably already decided what to do. Good Luck.  It's really touching that people would do anyhting to help their pets. |
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Post by blackie on Sept 14, 2004 6:09:40 GMT -8
Where is Queen of the Nile when you need her?
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Post by queenofthenile on Sept 14, 2004 7:10:04 GMT -8
I have tried hand feeding a 2 day old gerbil pup and it's impossible. He was the runt of the litter and wound up passing on a few days later. I was using KMR mixed with water.
The problem is that the pup is so small. There is literally *nothing* on the internet that talks about hand feeding very young pups. There is no information available until about 3 weeks of age.
I don't want to be the bearer of bad news, but the pup will very likely die. There is nothing you can do about it. If you feed with a syringe, it is very difficult to get the opening in the pup's mouth. Then you run a very high risk of suffocating the pup or getting milk in it's lungs.
Very small pups won't really suckle on bread soaked in KMR. At least this has been my experience. I'm really sorry, but there isn't much you can do.
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Post by mary on Sept 14, 2004 7:24:41 GMT -8
when does the pup get crucial, and how often does a mother feed a baby, or in other words how often do i need to feed it? when should i really start worrying about the pup to die, and really start the good caring?
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Post by r8ch on Sept 14, 2004 9:05:03 GMT -8
Hi
I have to agree with queenofthenile. I too have tried to feed a baby (shaw's jird) - from day one. He survived a week and was really doing well, or so it seemed. It is really hard work, feeding needs to be done at least every 2 hours and this means through the night as well (I was so tired that week!!). Plus you need to set up an incubator to keep the pup just at the right temperature without it being to hold or too cold. You also have to stimulate the little pup to deficate as well.There is stuff on the internet but VERY little about feeding pups. Gerbil pups are even smaller than shaws so i can't imagine how difficult it will be.
I think most vets (well in the UK at least) would have no real idea how to hand-rear a pup. Believe me I've asked and they can't really suggest much more than what is available on the internet from experienced breeders. A lot is trial and error I'm afraid when it comes to things like this as most people don't bother learning to successfully hand-rear.
R8ch
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Post by sandy2 on Sept 14, 2004 12:13:02 GMT -8
IF the mother isn't adequately feeding the baby (if you see milk in the belly, and its color is good, then leave things be) then your best bet is to foster the pup onto another nursing rodent--it doesn't even have to be a gerbi, just any rodent mom who's had babies in the last 2 weeks!
If you can't foster, then DO NOT take the pup away from the mom to keep it seperate from her, even if its not nursing--she will still keep it warm, wash it and stimulate it. If you have to try to feed it, syringe feed KMR or straight undiluted soy baby formula every 3 to 4 hours.
Feed too often and you can overfeed them. Gerbils cannot vomit, and they can die just from too full a stomach or from breathing it in. Clean up spills and stimulate the stomach and genitals with a q-tip, then put the pup back with mom for her to clean and stimulate. Do not force open the mouth, but if you put a drop of liquid on its lips it will suck it in. Avoid getting it on the nostrils. Yes, it can be done but it is hard. Let the mom help you.
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Post by ma on Sept 14, 2004 13:20:07 GMT -8
okay, new question, if i manage to keep him alive for say, 4 days till he grows fur and moves, and intentionally opened his eyes, do you think she would make it? her last litter of 2 both opened there eyes at about day 4 incredibly early and the male did not make it past day 6-7, but the female absolutley THRIVED with her new open eyes, ate solid food reallllly quick! so there is hope i think, but uhmmm she is about 30 hours old now, will i still be able to see if she has milk in her belly? if so what exactly am i looking for, be very descriptive!
:thanx for all the help guys, me and pinky appreciate it
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Post by sandy2 on Sept 14, 2004 16:01:40 GMT -8
Yes, you can still see milk in the belly up to about 10 days when the belly fur grows longer. I sometimes stretch them out a bit and then it shows.
Re: chance of survival, hard to say. Each few days there's another danger point. At least the pup hasn't got much competition.
Don't give up that the mom is feeding her. I have heard of mom gerbils raising only one pup that does make it. It depends totally on the mom's milk supply and hormonal response. Just keep a close eye, and supplement if she seems to be pale and not very squirmy.
A healthy really young pup will be bright pink and very squirmy when you hold it. It should also be developing a bit of fat by around 4 days. You can see the fat above the legs on the abdomen. If you see fat, then don't worry--it'll probably be fine. If it's thin and listless, and pale, then worry.
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I know with 1 pup it's hard because they can't stimulate the milk out of the mother on it's own.