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Post by crazycritter on Jul 7, 2005 21:22:28 GMT -8
Hey everyone,
I was just wondering if anyone here has had any experience with Spruce wood shavings? The petstore I supply sells it, and it's really cheap...the livestock manager said that he has used Spruce for a decade with hedgehogs, guineapigs, and the rodents in the store with no problems...but it IS a softwood like pine and cedar, but I have seen it reccomended over pine and cedar on a few mouse websites. I really want to use it because it's a 4cu.feet bag, which would last me forever. Do you think it would be ok for breeding gerbils?
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Post by maxthegerbil on Jul 8, 2005 3:26:22 GMT -8
Hi. I use shavings that are primarily spruce/fir and are from mostly european/british scources. As far as I`m aware, spruce is a safer alternative and pine/cedar should never be used as most people will argue.
What I do is this. Buy the bag of shavings and open the bag and tip out enough for using into a plastic bin. (Like the ones with handles on either side?). Rotate this amount of shavings on a daily basis for at least one month prior to using from one bin to another and hold a fistful of the shavings close to your nose and smell it. If the smell seems strong still, keep airing the shavings off until the `newish` smell has nearly gone. They should then be much safer to use than just using it straight from a newly opened bag, when the aroma will be pretty strong.
As an added measure, some shavings can still include fine dust (even though the manufacturers state dust extracted). So again, take the amount of shavings you want to use. Get hold of a kitchen seive that you would use for sifting flour. Take a handful of the shavings and place it in the seive. This can be done outside! Gently shake the seive and if very fine particles appear through the holes, then you will have to seive the whole amount before using it. I`ve had to do this once, but the shavings I purchased were not up to my standard, so I will be swapping back to the shavings I was using previously.
If you use this method, your shavings will be very useable and you don`t have to worry about strong odours and dust! Hope this helps.
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Post by crazycritter on Jul 8, 2005 11:27:49 GMT -8
Doesn't that take a really long time? I have seven gerbil tanks, three guinea pig cages, rabbit litter boxes, a mouse cage..and...I think that's it....that just seems like it would take far to long to make using it practical for me. I can do that seive thing, for sure, but letting it sit for a month is pretty hard, especially since I already bought it and my gerbils are waiting for a cage change. Does anyone else have any information? Should I try it out on my gerbs and just watch closely for any signs of respiratory distress in the pups?
Thanks a lot for your help, maxthegerbil, I really appreciate it!
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Post by crazycritter on Jul 8, 2005 19:57:54 GMT -8
I decided to take a chance...I put a pair on spruce today, with 8 pups. I'm going to check on them a lot, and watch for any negative signs...including longer sleeps, greasy fur, clicking, wierd breathing, weight loss....I'll keep an eye on them.
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Post by maxthegerbil on Jul 9, 2005 3:05:53 GMT -8
Hi Crazycritter. Maybe one month of `airing` might have been a little far fetched to be honest. I know it can be time consuming to do! If you open the bag when you acquire it even to allow the air to get at it and allow the shavings to `breathe` a little before usage, then I suppose that`s all you can do. Rotating shavings from box to box on a daily basis and using a seive to reduce the amount of dust that shavings usually carry is the best method I`ve used basically to try and reduce aroma and dust. That`s not always practical, I know. You could use lots of plain white toilet tissue/kitchen roll paper for the babies to lie on too, just incase lying directly on top of new shavings irritates their respiratory tract, just as a precaution?
One other thing before I end is, if you have a single mouse (as I do)! You may or may not be aware that mice and rats carry mycoplasma bacteria. They are it`s primary hosts and it can be even more aggravated by sawdust/shavings. I keep my mouse on small cardboard squares which are recycled and primarily manufactured as a horse bedding. You won`t get this in the U.S, but there may be an alternative, paper based litter for your mouse? Just a thought. Mycoplasma affects the rat/mouse upper respiratory tract and if your mouse sneezes a lot or produces `red tears` (porphyrin) satins around the eyes and nose, then the shavings could well aggravate this. I know it`s difficult finding alternative litter for mice and rats when all stores sell is shavings! But they obviously don`t know anything about this respiratory problem in mice and rats, but they should. Good luck with your new babies! Spruce is better than pine or cedar, but I`m talking more european spruce here. I can`t say where your spruce originated, the U.S or europe?
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Post by crazycritter on Jul 9, 2005 19:08:47 GMT -8
Thanks for the advice  My rats don't have any litter (wire cage floor with mats for resting) that they sit directly on, and we use newspaper and aspen for the trays. The mouse has shredded newspaper and aspen as well. He has never reacted to aspen, and I haven't tried him on spruce...if it goes alright with the gerbs though, I might. |
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Post by RitzieAnn on Jul 9, 2005 21:21:12 GMT -8
Doesn't your mouse just reak on aspen? We had one, and he was the STINK in the entire house, and that's saying a LOT beceause there were 26 gerbils, and a rat, and a hamster. Hum.... anyway.... i've never even heard of that type of bedding. I use corn cob, because I can get a 40 pound bag for about $16, and I have 5 gerbil cages. What type of bedding were you using before? I'd mix them. I know that a few of my gerbils freaked out when I changed their bedding type all of a sudden.
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Post by maxthegerbil on Jul 10, 2005 0:03:09 GMT -8
Hi again Crazycritter. I would keep your mouse on the paper based litter and possibly the corncob. I would`nt use the spruce, or any other type of shavings for a mouse or a rat, because of the fact that they are much more prone to repiratory related problems through carrying the mycoplasma bacteria in their airways. Shavings of any kind can aggravate it and if your wee mousie has been doing fine on the paper based bedding, I would keep him on this and use the spruce for the gerbils. Mycoplasma is another reason why mice and rats should not be housed in glass aquariums because the air flow is`nt good enough. These animals prefer barred cages. Especially mice because they love to climb!
Male mice scent small drops of urine periodically and it can smell fishy at times! Spraying the cage and accessories with a mixture of one part chlorine bleech and ten parts water, then using boiling water to thoroughly rince everything kills any germs or opportunistic bacteria that may be lurking. Make sure everything is rinsed and dried off thoroughly, because bleech has a very strong aroma. If you can still smell it after washing, it needs rinsing more. I do this outside!
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Post by tirilliel on Jul 10, 2005 5:14:08 GMT -8
I don’t know that much about spruce bedding? I cant say Iv ever seen it readily available here in the US, at lest where am located, I see allot of pine and cedar, but the only thing I get is Aspen because it has no aromatic oils. Aromatic oils are a big concerns with rodents and other creatures these days, many people are learning about the bad affects of these two shavings and are changed to hemp, aspen or products similar to care fresh. So if you know that Spruce does not have aromatic oils like pine and cedar Id imagine that it was ok to use then..
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My rats don't have any litter (wire cage floor with mats for resting) that they sit directly on, and we use newspaper and aspen for the trays. The mouse has shredded newspaper and aspen as well. He has never reacted to aspen, and I haven't tried him on spruce...if it goes alright with the gerbs though, I might. 
