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Colour?
Jun 2, 2004 10:20:29 GMT -8
Post by Ollie on Jun 2, 2004 10:20:29 GMT -8
:)Hi My 2 gerbils recently (about 4 weeks ago) had there first litter of pups. The parents are lilac and ... i am not sure. She seems to in between a siamese and burmease. I wonder if she is lcp slate? Or maybe even the tolkenese colour? That is what my breeder said. There pups were 1 black...and the others...seem like a lighter version. I think they are slate, maybe? Could they be the same as the mom though? What do lcp slate pups look like? What is lcp slate genetics? What is tolkenese genetics? What are the colour possibilities that they could have, firstly if she was a lcp slate, and secondly, tolkenese? What are the percentages of each color? Thank you sooo much! I know its a lot to ask for but i would apreeciate it. Thanks, Ollie
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Colour?
Jun 2, 2004 10:30:21 GMT -8
Post by Ollie on Jun 2, 2004 10:30:21 GMT -8
btw, lilacs parents are lilac and rew lcp slate( or whatever she is) are siamese, yet there is a bit of burmease down the line , thus the improper colouring... thx so much quick replies would be the best
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Post by Ritzie/Admin on Jun 4, 2004 4:49:15 GMT -8
The tokanese colour is not a real colour! It is a name that is not correct in my opinion, and are most likely CP slates or LCP slates! Here are pictures of slates (including CP slates), the LCP's are lighter: www.agsgerbils.org/Color_Strip/slate.html. Maybe this is a lcp slate (but I'm not sure): . Someone told me that, but I'm not a cp-expert!
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Post by Ollie on Jun 4, 2004 8:15:02 GMT -8
that gerbil picture you posted is exactly the same colour as mine. she must be lcp slate. can u answer my other questions? thanks!
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Colour?
Jun 4, 2004 14:18:01 GMT -8
Post by Ritzie/Admin on Jun 4, 2004 14:18:01 GMT -8
I think you mean about the genetics?
Lilac: aa CC D- E- G- pp spsp REW: aa CC D- E- gg pp spsp
siamese: aa cc[H] D- E- G- P- spsp burmese: aa cc D- E- G- P- spsp
CP Slate: aa cc D- E- gg P- spsp LCP Slate: aa cc[H] D- E- gg P- spsp
(note: the correct new notation for the burmese gene is now actually c[chm] and not c which is now the old notation. But c is easy to see the difference).)
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Colour?
Jun 4, 2004 14:25:40 GMT -8
Post by Ritzie/Admin on Jun 4, 2004 14:25:40 GMT -8
Parents: Lilac: aa CC DD EE GG pp spsp CP Slate: aa c c DD EE gg PP spsp
Pups: aa Cc DD EE Gg Pp spsp = black gerbils! 100%
But when the parent is a LCP Slate, than the pups can be: aa Cc DD EE Gg Pp spsp = black gerbils! 50% or aa Cc[h] DD EE Gg Pp spsp = black gerbils, but maybe lighter (I'm not sure, probably just black)! 50 % So most likely also 100% black gerbils!
And when both parents have Pp in their genetics, than the pups can also be: aa Cc DD EE Gg pp spsp = Sapphire gerbils! 25% aa Cc[h] DD EE Gg pp spsp = Dove gerbils! 25% And than the black gerbils 50%
It depends on how much recessive genes they have! If both have more recessive genes more different colours are possible!
Ik hope this is a bit helpfull for you! If not please ask! That's why we're here!! ;D
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Colour?
Jun 5, 2004 11:39:04 GMT -8
Post by OLLIE on Jun 5, 2004 11:39:04 GMT -8
THAT IS VERY HELPFUL! CAN YOU WORK OUT THE PARENTS GENETICS PLUS RECESSIVES FROM THIS THOUGH? LILAC IS DAD. PARENTS ARE LILAC AND REW LCP SLATE IS MUM. PARENTS ARE BOTH SIAMESE WITH BURMEASE DOWN LINE. THEIR PUPS ARE MANLY SLATE AND 1 BLACK. IF YOU CAN UNCOVER ANY RECESSIVES FROM THSI PLEASE TELL ME. WHAT ARE THE POSSIBILITIES THEIR PUPS COLOURS? THANKS, I KNOW I ALREADY ASKED THIS BUT I DONT THINK IT MAKES SENSE. THX SO MUCH.
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Colour?
Jun 5, 2004 23:28:56 GMT -8
Post by Ollie on Jun 5, 2004 23:28:56 GMT -8
[glow=red,2,300]Surely the fact that they had slate babies can uncover recessives. because i think black is the colour they can have without any.thanks so much (if you can tell the colours % pleaseeeeeeeeeeee! sorry for a ;lot to ask for.... thank you so much.[/glow]
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Colour?
Jun 7, 2004 17:13:25 GMT -8
Post by moghedien on Jun 7, 2004 17:13:25 GMT -8
Hey everyone! I'm new here. Ollie, backtracking through the colors you gave gave me the following for the parent's genetics: Father (Lilac): aa CC E- Gg pp Mother (LCP Slate): aa c c E- gg P-
The only sure recessive from the info given is the g from the father (because REW has gg and all babies would have one recessive g). Assuming no other recessives the offspring should be 50% black and 50% slate. If the mother has a recessive p then you would also get REW and sapphire. It seems unlikely that they would both have a recessive e, but if they did, nutmeg would also be a possibility.
Hope that helps!
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Colour?
Jun 9, 2004 10:24:17 GMT -8
Post by Ollie on Jun 9, 2004 10:24:17 GMT -8
great helps tons thanks
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Colour?
Jun 20, 2004 9:13:35 GMT -8
Post by Ollie on Jun 20, 2004 9:13:35 GMT -8
just read this and do not understand something how can they have REW? BREEDING A LILAC AND LCP SLATE WILL ONLY GIVE YOU CCh or CCb gerbil and rew has CC! AM I WRONG? PLEASE EXPLAIN!
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Colour?
Jun 21, 2004 5:18:28 GMT -8
Post by Ritzie/Admin on Jun 21, 2004 5:18:28 GMT -8
It is possible to have a REW, because Cc[chm] (or Cc, how you will call it) will have no effect on the colour of the gerbils, sometimes on some dark colours maybe, because the Sapphire gerbil has C, but that is the only one I know of. Cc[h] with the combination pp will cause lighter animals, so than you can probably have a Pink Eyed White (PEW).
Here some info on de C-genes: c[chm] = burmese pattern, Chinchilla Medium (sometimes also refered with the symbol c, but this symbol has been replaced by c[chm] around 2001 for genetic notation after this scientific paper in the Journal of Heredity). c[H] = himalayan (turns hairs into white)
CC gives fully coloured gerbils. Cc[H], in combination with pp, gives gerbils with a lighter coat. c[H]c[H] gives white gerbils which can have a dark tail. Ccchm gives normal coloured gerbils. cchm cchm gives gerbils with a burmese pattern. cchm cH gives gerbils with a siamese pattern.
Note: c(chm) replaced c(b) around 2001 for genetic notation after this scientific paper in the journal of heredity: Petrij F, van Veen K, Mettler M, and Brückman V. 2001, A second acromelanistic allelomorph at the albino locus of the Mongolian gerbil (Meriones unguiculatus). Journal of Heredity, 92(1), 74-78. It reports a second mutation at the c-locus. It describes a mutation that resembles chinchilla medium (symbol c[chm] in the rabbit.) As this is the colour that closely resembles the colourpoint gold agouti(pearl).
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