I did something really stupid need serious help

[Idiot]

For the past 2 months I've been having a lot of problems with fighting. I had a cage of 3 and 5. Fighting, chasing, bleeding..on and off problems. Out of all my males, 6 are brothers, 1 isn't related but only 2 months older. They're all about 1. In both tanks, there is ongoing battles for dominance and the same 2 keep winning and the others are getting hurt.

I had what I thought was a good idea.. of split caging both tanks and trying to group them together. Then I could regroup them. I split caged them for a couple of days. And of course the dominant gerbils in the group of 5 were lunging at the screen at first. Things seemed to settle down today and I did the bath tub introduction method.

That also seemed to go OK. Of course untill they were completely dry and everyone started running around and jumping going crazy.

Basically right now I'm just watching them and I took out 2 dominants that normally do NOT get along and they're together..ok for now.(this will NOT last forever)

I don't know what to do. I obviously made things worse. I can't seperate all my gerbils into groups of 2. I need to try and at least keep as many together as possible. But at this point, it seems like they all hate eachother.

[callimico]

What size tank are they all in? It could be the space was to cramped for that colony and resulted in increased chasing and nipping.

It's very hard to introduce to established groups to one another. I would try to introduce the original groups of 3 and 5 back to one another, and maybe expand their space, provide more bedding, toys, etc. If all else fails you may need two groups of two and one of three, using hte split-cage method to introduce them over time. I hope it all works out for you.

[Idiot]

Size isn't the issue. The trio was in a 20 gallon and the 5 were in a 40 gallon. They had enough toys and things. That actually made things worse because the more I put in, the more I'd hear shuffling and running through things, then thumping and seeing someone bloody or being chased. When I took everything out and they all just sit in a corner bored out of their minds. Then they would dig in the corners and squeak because they'd step on eachother and fight over who got to dig at the corner.

I ended up putting them all in a small bucket and they're just sitting there squeaking and boxing at eachother. If I regroup the original colonies then I'll just end up going through this again with the split caging. Maybe I'll try that if things get worse.

I'm thinking maybe put my 2 agressive dominants split cage and just leave them like that forever. I don't see them getting along with anyone.

[doomgerbiluk]

that was a rather overambitious project, but you meant well.
You can't got backwards so let go forwards.
How does the large group do minus the dominant pair??
A fussy cage is a mistake lots of people make (done it myself).
Too many toys , especially dens and houses or worse sectioned cages, can lead to the formation of seperate groups or individuals each with their own territory.
It is important to get a balance and not always easy to get right.
My suggestion have a one or two 'dens', a hanging one is nice (I use coconuts) a wheel if practical, some tubes between dens and add other toys occasionally. Cardboard, toilet tubes, tissue etc are great.
if you want more toys (especially a plastic wheel) I suggest a playpen, secure room or empty bath (dry and plug in) with toys they can explore while out of the cage. This out of cage time is fun for you and the gerbils but there is no time to establish territories.
Meanwhile you need to try to establish which gerbils are able to get on and split cage others.
Good luck and I hope everything works out for you.

[Idiot]

Things are still hectic. They've settled down a bit but only because they're all exhuasted and haven't slept since this morning.

I have had problems with my nutmeg since the day I got him. He is the dominant in the trio. I thought he was a loner, but I tried him by himself and he got depressed. When I first got him the others were still pups and I had all 10 together. (+parents). After a few weeks I seperated. He kind of acted the same then; he'd squeak and lunge at anyone who came near him. He ended up in a duo and then a trio with the most "submissive" babies and as they got older /now I started having problems. He'd even sleep by himself a lot. Not territorial, just he'd fall asleep on the wheel and never find where the others are. If they found him, then they'd sleep together.

Anyway, he is doing the same thing now. Anyone who goes near him just to sniff he starts attacking, squeaking and jumping. In the bucket he got the others all on top of eachother against the side while he got his own little section with nobody touching him. He doesn't want his old cage mates near him either. He's boxing them even after smelling them. But he's exhuausted the most and can't keep his eyes open.

The other 2 seem to be blending in with the large group now. Still a little pissy at eachother but calming down. They can be next to eachother without doing what the nutmeg is doing. A couple of them got some bad bite wounds; but acting OK.(except nutmeg) One from the trio keep finding himself back to the nutmeg and trying to sleep with him but nutmeg is still scared. (the one nutmeg would harass) Nutmeg getting scared and squeaking/jumping sets off the others every now and then.

Taking out the other dominants didn't help much for the nutmeg since he's just afraid of everyone. Taking the nutmeg out seemed to help. I'm not sure on that.


Sorry that was long. But wow this is a mess.

[idiot]

Ok update.

I managed to get the original groups back together. I put the trio in the 40 gallon tank figuring nutmeg would have more room to hide if he wanted. He's now sleeping on the other 2 and the other group is also sleeping togehter and no more fighting.

I'm going to try keeping the tanks simple for a while even though i'd really like to split up the group of 5. It's alwyas the same freaking 2 getting picked on by that 1 dom. All 5 of them sleep together in the same spot even though the nest seems to change frequently because its usually a box that gets chewed down in a couple of days. And the 2 that get picked on seem to hide out in the nest from him a lot. I'll try getting them something to use as a permanent nest box maybe that will help. At least in the trio they don't seem to hide from one another, chasing, boxing, sometimes fighting on top of eachother but not a tight ball. UGH.